My own composed theory: The psychological blockade of the...

Discussion related to Media
SandRock
Posts: 141
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2004 6:07 pm

Re: My own composed theory: The psychological blockade of the...

Postby SandRock » Wed Feb 16, 2011 11:46 pm

[FnG] 7uh wrote:Thanks very much! :D

The theory seems like a perfectly reasonable inference from history (science explaining things once thought divine) and human nature (the need for an explanation even in the face of the unexplainable).

Personally, I differ with the opinion that there's no God ... but, it certainly seems clear that humans are capable of understanding much that was once thought magical or supernatural. Still, a lot of scientists believe in God. As science progresses, it seems to me that the idea of divine existence has shifted from mechanism ("how else could this phenomenon happen?") to origin ("who or what STARTED the universe in the first place?"). We know that lightning is basically static electricity created by water and ice in clouds, and we can presume that future scientific knowledge will be able to explain things we don't know yet in terms of pure physical and chemical phenomena. So the question is shifted to an area that puts science on a less sound footing. Where did the matter and energy within the universe originally come from? Something doesn't come from nothing. Science may never be able to explain it. Or maybe one day it will! It's ... kind of a matter of faith.

So here's my theory. Believing that there's no God is an outgrowth of the conviction that science will ultimately be able to explain everything. This conviction requires a level of faith in science equal to that of the religious person's faith in God.

Flame away as appropriate ... :crazy:


Hehe. Well personally I can accept the existence of 'God' but not as any of the organized religions make it out to be. Rather, I can accept some sort of 'force' or 'energy' so to speak that doesn't have to be conscience as we know it. Like it doesn't 'think' or.. let's say, act like it has a brain. More instinctual, simply being. An energy that drives creation, life, etc.

Not that I believe this, but I'd see it more like that. Where to me religion is very man made, and in time has mostly been employed as a effective way to gain power and control over the masses as well as fables, myth and stories written as analogies to convey meaning about how to live a morally sound life. More like an ancient lawbook.

But that's just personal opinion.


Something doesn't come from nothing.


I think this is an important part, which is what probably had me thinking about all this in the first place all those years ago. And I can better understand what I thought of back then now. I'm not sure entirely who argued this, I think it might've been Foucault or Levi-Strauss. Basically they say how language has actually shaped our understanding of the world. It changed the way we think and perceive things. Basically language has determined our 'box' and we think 'inside the box'. That's sort of what I was thinking about back then. We have come to see that something is created in some way. A table, wood, a tree, the seed, life, we all know something spurred it's creation. So you keep tracing it back further and further and like you said, you end up with the question of what created matter. But even if you find that answer, let's say it's God. Then that's still not an answer, because who created God? :P It would be a never ending story, one which eventually HAS to stop at the conclusion that something did in fact come from nothing. Which is hard for us to comprehend because we want to explain everything.

That's sort of what I was thinking about back then. And I thought I could give the answer to all mankind and be the savior of all knowledge and science :woot:


[FnG] Hanno wrote:I'm sure there was a flame thrower smilely here somewhere....

Actually I sort of agree with Sandrock, apart from the word blockade where I would say blockage.
The majority of people find it easier to accept a fiction about something than be able to accept a simple ' we don't know;we might never know'
and another majority of people find it very hard to say "I don't know' and are quite happy to make up something instead.

Its one of the hardest lessons I found out when I started work that its a better idea to say 'I don't know but I'll find out' rather than 'winging' it
Its odd I can handle that well now but I still haven't figured out how best to lie for other people.
I have had a week of typing emails that should of said "because XXXX are a bunch of idiots who can't find there XXXXX with both hands"
and having to make up diplomatic excuses for XXXXX instead. It is very stressful!


Yeah accepting that you don't know things and it's ok not to know things can be quite liberating. It's extended further than that for me. If something bad happens, I don't like it, but I now find solace in it. I move on and see no point in dwelling in the past, but rather think how this has changed my situation and what my remaining options are, where and how to proceed. It's sort of a 'letting go' mentality. Rather than always being the one holding the reigns.

There was this awesome chinese proverb we got in history class back when i was 14 or something. *Goes to google it* Cant find it unfortunately :(
Basically the jist of it was:

Two men get tied to the wheel of a cart. As it moves forward, one man does not accept his faith and fights back, getting dragged along the ground by the cart. The other man accepts his faith and walks along with the cart, not getting hurt.

Or in more modern terms: Go with the flow :P


And yeah having to cover for people often sucks. Being the good guy is always crap ;) It's the same when you work on something in a team and you do most of the work but everyone gets equal credit, and then the other people start claiming their credit full heartily :P




Here's another thing that totally blew my mind and still find hard to comprehend, but you all probably already know it since it's not that unknown.

Time is relative is pretty well known. But I personally never stopped to think about what it really meant and what it's implications are until my friend and I started to discuss it. Turns out that time is affected by gravitational pull and speed. So if you would travel at the speed of light, time slows down for you by a lot. That means that if you were to travel somewhere several lightyears away and come back to Earth, you would've hardly aged while people on Earth that you knew might all be dead already.
It sounds so science-fiction (Planet of the Apes) and mind blowing I still find it hard to comprehend this is real and pretty much scientifically proven... fascinating.


PS. Never thought after so many years I'd be talking about this again in a serious fashion, especially since I've always considered my self an arrogant prick because of the way I talked about this back then :p

User avatar
[FnG] Hanno
Posts: 2714
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 8:16 pm
Location: Devon , SW UK
Contact:

Re: My own composed theory: The psychological blockade of the...

Postby [FnG] Hanno » Thu Feb 17, 2011 12:58 pm

SandRock wrote:PS. Never thought after so many years I'd be talking about this again in a serious fashion, especially since I've always considered my self an arrogant prick because of the way I talked about this back then :p


I suspect many educated people were arrogant pricks when they were 16 - I was, possibly still am - except I have had many
of my allusions shattered and now have little hopes or ambition and work just as hard as I have to to get by.

That time is relative is an equation balanced by relatives costing time.

Yesterday at work I spent an hour trying to work out how magnets worked in terms of energy transfer/conservation.
What I mean is that I can see that magnets store energy when the fields are initially aligned in an electricty field.
But does a magnet burn that energy when it attacts an object eg stored energy converted to kinectic energy and then to sound as the items click together. But then is any of that energy converted back into stored energy as you pull the item away from the magnet.
If not then the magnet would lose its power a little bit every time its used.
With gravity you can always see where the potential/kinetic energy goes, with magnetism it seems a little more opaque to me.
But then as its all comes down to spin on electrons and such its pretty hard to see anyway :bedrime:
Image
Hanno's Law:
Anyone who says they know what's going on are probably lying.
Anyone who believes they know what's going on is dangerous and should be avoided at all cost.

User avatar
[FnG] ParanoiDinHELL
Posts: 3121
Joined: Thu Mar 04, 2004 6:30 pm
Location: Netherlands
Contact:

Re: My own composed theory: The psychological blockade of the...

Postby [FnG] ParanoiDinHELL » Thu Feb 17, 2011 8:46 pm

SandRock wrote:
Something doesn't come from nothing.



Interesting one to point out (I'm a non-believer :) ) .. Where did god come from?
Anyway, experiencing religion can be measured in your brain, certain parts being activated. Most humans are more sensible to believing for that matter. So if something excists or not isn't all that interesting, you can never prove it and therefor you can (more) easily proof that it doesn't exist. Most people will still feel as if it exists and if that gives them purpose, it's all good. As long as they dont try to force theyr view on others.
Image

User avatar
[FnG] 7uh
Posts: 7958
Joined: Thu Aug 19, 2004 4:16 pm
Location: Southern Connecticut USA
Contact:

Re: My own composed theory: The psychological blockade of the...

Postby [FnG] 7uh » Thu Feb 17, 2011 9:17 pm

Someone said that the point of education is to teach us what we don't know. Once we know that we don't know something, we can try to find out - through books, classes, experiments, etc. But if we're unaware of what we don't know, then we don't have the first clue about what questions to ask, or how to find the answer. It's more than half the battle to realize that we really don't know very much about the world.

SandRock
Posts: 141
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2004 6:07 pm

Re: My own composed theory: The psychological blockade of the...

Postby SandRock » Thu Feb 17, 2011 10:37 pm

[FnG] Hanno wrote:
SandRock wrote:PS. Never thought after so many years I'd be talking about this again in a serious fashion, especially since I've always considered my self an arrogant prick because of the way I talked about this back then :p


I suspect many educated people were arrogant pricks when they were 16 - I was, possibly still am - except I have had many
of my allusions shattered and now have little hopes or ambition and work just as hard as I have to to get by.

That time is relative is an equation balanced by relatives costing time.

Yesterday at work I spent an hour trying to work out how magnets worked in terms of energy transfer/conservation.
What I mean is that I can see that magnets store energy when the fields are initially aligned in an electricty field.
But does a magnet burn that energy when it attacts an object eg stored energy converted to kinectic energy and then to sound as the items click together. But then is any of that energy converted back into stored energy as you pull the item away from the magnet.
If not then the magnet would lose its power a little bit every time its used.
With gravity you can always see where the potential/kinetic energy goes, with magnetism it seems a little more opaque to me.
But then as its all comes down to spin on electrons and such its pretty hard to see anyway :bedrime:


I don't know :P

Funny how something so common as a magnet is something I now realize I know so little about. If I had to make a guess without using google or wikipedia (i say this so I don't look so stupid if I say something completely idiotic now) then perhaps magnets absorb energy from somewhere else? DO magnets ever lose their power? I don't know. If they do, does Earth's gravity function along the lines of a magnet? And could Earth lose it's gravitational field too? I know some planet got it's gravitational field all messed up because of large asteroid impacts.

User avatar
[FnG] ParanoiDinHELL
Posts: 3121
Joined: Thu Mar 04, 2004 6:30 pm
Location: Netherlands
Contact:

Re: My own composed theory: The psychological blockade of the...

Postby [FnG] ParanoiDinHELL » Fri Feb 18, 2011 12:20 am

Funny things happen that require either smarter minds or more research :)
Image


Return to “Media Discussion”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests